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  #81  
Old 10-23-2016, 07:37 PM
Sersemina Sersemina is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 174
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"More experience = more levels, better equipment and eventually more gold" - people often say that and they are probably right ... but are they?

There is a huge difference between a player level 25 and a player level 50, also a significant difference between a player level 225 and 250, but is the difference between a player 425 and 450 even noticeable?

GeorgeKen, one of the strongest players worldwide has already given his advice on switching to gold at level 375 for shroomers and 350 for non-shroomers. Here are my reasons why I will start playing for gold when I reach level 400 at the end of the year:

A few observations:
  • Each level improves your epic's main attribute by 5 points - this includes:
    1. the actual main attribute improvement ~1.6 points
    2. constitution improvement = 1.6 (half that valuable) = 0.8 * 1.25 (Potion of Eternal Life) = 1.0
    3. luck improvement is practically 0 at this level (once you reach 10K luck)
    4. gem improvement ~ 1 point
    5. all this is multiplied by 1.25 (potion bonus) and then 1.20 (pet bonus)
  • All in all each level improves your primary attribute equipment roughly by 50 points.
  • When I play for gold I get twice more gold. When I play for experience, I get twice more experience so I will level twice faster.
  • I need roughly a week to level up. This means 52 levels a year.
  • I earn about 13 primary points a day when playing for experience. That's 400 points a month.
  • Weapon damage gives me about 3.5 damage per level (this probably includes my toiler aura bonus).
  • Each point I buy is multiplied by 1.5 (1.25 potion * 1.2 pets)
  • I am a scout.
Let's have a look at how I will look at the end of 2016 and how I will look a year later depending on whether I choose to follow the path of either experience or gold:

End of 2016:
Level: 400
Dexterity: 30000
Weapon: 400 * 3.5 = 1400
Damage ~ 1400 * 3000 = 4.2 mln

End of 2017:
Scenario 1 - Play for Experience:
Level: 452
Dexterity: 30000 + 12 * 400 * 1.5 = 37200 + (52 * 50) = 39800
Weapon: 452 * 3.5 = 1582
Damage ~ 1582 * 3980 = 6.3 mln

Scenario 2 - Play for Gold:
Level: 426
Dexterity: 30000 + 12 * 800 * 1.5 = 44400 + (26 * 50) = 45700
Weapon: 426 * 3.5 = 1491
Damage ~ 1491 * 4570 = 6.8 mln

So a year later even if I have 6% more health (thanks to level 452 vs 426), even with the better items, better gems and weapon damage, I will have 8% more total damage if I play for gold. Let's say the experience player will have a twice higher gold income increase (25%) compared to the gold player (12.5%). Here is how things may look in another year:

End of 2018:
Scenario 1 - Play for Experience:
Level: 504
Dexterity: 40000 + 12 * 500 * 1.5 = 49000 + (52 * 50) = 51600
Weapon: 504 * 3.5 = 1764
Damage ~ 1764 * 5160 = 9.1 mln

Scenario 2 - Play for Gold:
Level: 452
Dexterity: 46000 + 12 * 900 * 1.5 = 62200 + (26 * 50) = 63500
Weapon: 452 * 3.5 = 1582
Damage ~ 1582 * 6350 = 10 mln


The experience player got a twice higher salary bump and yet he is not catching up with the gold player but instead, the gap is increasing from 8% to 10%. It really makes no sense to try to predict anything further in the future as many things can change, but this is how I see the trend. You should decide for yourself.
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  #82  
Old 10-24-2016, 02:01 AM
rvm1975 rvm1975 is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 181
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Quote:
When I play for gold I get twice more gold. When I play for experience, I get twice more experience so I will level twice faster.
This statement is wrong.

I have a lot of logs of every quests proposed for ~3 months and can analyze. Difference is 55-60% not 100%

Quote:
End of 2018:
Level: 504
Level: 452
Wrong as well. Difference in exp bigger. It is 65-70% So levels will be

504
435-440

Last edited by rvm1975; 10-24-2016 at 02:04 AM.
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  #83  
Old 10-24-2016, 04:23 PM
Sersemina Sersemina is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvm1975 View Post
This statement is wrong.

I have a lot of logs of every quests proposed for ~3 months and can analyze. Difference is 55-60% not 100%



Wrong as well. Difference in exp bigger. It is 65-70% So levels will be

504
435-440
I can't quite get it. I noticed that during gold events I get about 120-130 mln exp compared to ordinary days when I play for experience (190 mln exp). So the difference is probably not twice more/less exp/gold. I will know that in a week as I just started tracking a fellow's stats yesterday - he is a guildmate same level as me and he plays for gold. I need some time to collect data. You need to bear in mind that tracking what quests offer you is not as accurate as tracking what you get at the end of the day.

And again, if you get 65% experience when you play for gold compared to playing for experience, you should have:
Exp player: lvl 400 + 100% * 104 = 504 lvl at the end of 2018.
Gold player: level 400 + 65% * 104 = 468 lvl at the end of 2018.

Did you have anything else in mind when you came up with these numbers?
504
435-440
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  #84  
Old 10-25-2016, 01:47 AM
rvm1975 rvm1975 is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 181
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I meant logs like that

Quote:
20161024 22:24:08 Info Tavern Quest 1: 02:30 min, 583200 gold (3888/s), 1111281 ep (7408.54/s)
20161024 22:24:08 Info Tavern Quest 2: 10:00 min, 4577000 gold (7628.33/s), 2835157 ep (4725.26/s)
20161024 22:24:08 Info Tavern Quest 3: 07:30 min, 5657400 gold (12572/s), 1097390 ep (2438.64/s)
As you can see difference of exp per second for best exp and best gold quest is more then 100%. It is actually ~200%

Also you do not count stupid 10kk quest cap issue. In this example I am getting capped quests even from non red quests and in normal days (not gold weekend) at lvl 427.

10kk quest limit issue
Quote:
Quest: 02:30 min, 10000000 gold (66666.67/s), 427843 ep (2852.29/s)
Quest: 05:00 min, 10000000 gold (33333.33/s), 2767003 ep (9223.34/s)
Quest: 07:30 min, 10000000 gold (22222.22/s), 1889772 ep (4199.49/s)
Quest: 10:00 min, 10000000 gold (16666.67/s), 1985162 ep (3308.6/s)

Last edited by rvm1975; 10-25-2016 at 01:50 AM.
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  #85  
Old 10-25-2016, 08:22 AM
Tilithia Tilithia is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 203
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where do you enable logs?
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"...the last shall be first, and the first, last..."
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  #86  
Old 10-25-2016, 01:48 PM
rvm1975 rvm1975 is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilithia View Post
where do you enable logs?
No way to do it in game. And using 3rdpaty tools is not allowed in S&F
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  #87  
Old 10-25-2016, 02:03 PM
Sersemina Sersemina is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 174
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Thanks for the clarification, rvm1975 I didn't know the 10 mln gold cap is such a problem, I hope they will eliminate that soon (why not on Thursday). The first set of quests you gave only shows that the XP difference can reach 200%, but that's not always the case. I am tracking the stats of the strongest player on s1.de and he gets about 28 attribute points per day and 100 mln experience. That's about twice more gold and half the experience I earn (I am level 392 and he is level 418). I guess we will have to reevaluate the situation in a couple of days after the big update
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  #88  
Old 10-25-2016, 03:04 PM
rvm1975 rvm1975 is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sersemina View Post
Thanks for the clarification, rvm1975 I didn't know the 10 mln gold cap is such a problem, I hope they will eliminate that soon (why not on Thursday). The first set of quests you gave only shows that the XP difference can reach 200%, but that's not always the case. I am tracking the stats of the strongest player on s1.de and he gets about 28 attribute points per day and 100 mln experience. That's about twice more gold and half the experience I earn (I am level 392 and he is level 418). I guess we will have to reevaluate the situation in a couple of days after the big update
Well I pointed the quest reward gold cap potential issue in 2013 http://forum.sfgame.us/showthread.php?t=6938

No big hope for fix in nearest time.

Last edited by rvm1975; 10-25-2016 at 03:06 PM.
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  #89  
Old 10-25-2016, 06:00 PM
Arturu Arturu is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 249
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One important thing should be kept in mind. Rewards or at least gold rewards increase with level. I have no idea at how big of a rate though.

Also many people use Wheel of Fortune and there's gold and XP from that.


The 10 million gold limit is actually a huge problem on gold event. I don't really know why it's still there. With it we earn less points and with less points character progress is less visible which makes people get bored with the game more quickly.

That's actually the reason they got rid of XP nerf after level 300.
Gold limit should definitely be removed.
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